Thursday, May 7, 2009

A tribute

It’s the end of an era, really.

As those of you who have nothing better to do than follow Linux news might have heard, Debian is switching to eglibc.

What’s eglibc you say? since nobody will say it in public, I will. It’s just glibc, sans jackass. The project says they’re trying to “maintain an open development environment encouraging broad, cooperative developer participation”, but those of you who have been around know exactly what this means.

F. U. D.

Yes, that’s right. Fuck Ulrich Drepper.

The Drepper’s public jackassery knows no limits. In fact, I could learn a thing or two from him. But you know, it’s really reassuring to know that for the last N years, the core library of the Linux desktop was maintained by the biggest douchebag of them all.

For the unitiated, go click that Debian link, and find all the referenced bugs. Let me summarize: Found a bug? expect a high probability of being responded to with:

“Fuck you”

“You don’t pay me”

“ARM sucks. Fuck ARM”

“You can’t be aksin me no questions. Who da fuck is you to be aksin me these questions?”

.. or all of the above, if you’re good. If you want more, try googling “Ulrich Drepper arrogant” for a nice sampling.

Anyways, the the Debian move signals an end to the Dreppster’s reign of terror. I will miss him, really. Thanks for holding glibc back for years man. It has certainly made writing this blog easier. You may be a decent programmer, but that’s definitely not what I’ll remember you for.

I can’t decide which is worse. Novell paying GregKH or Redhat paying Drepper. I hope they duel some day.

600 flames:

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Anonymous said...


Anonymous said...

Another great post by LH! Love this one.

Linux = Epic Fail

Super Pédant Man said...

Is that "rain of terror" the result of a pissing contest?

Anonymous said...

I can tell you (from personal experience), that the Microsoft kernel architect was not willing to hear about supporting NUMA, and even now does so reluctantly since AMD started yelling.

There's assholes everywhere.
Drepper is just an alpha asshole.


Anonymous said...

Thanks. That post brightened up my day.

Anonymous said...

The first Desktop linux stable API/ABI distro without driver issues and optimised workflow

Anonymous said...

@May 7, 2009 2:37 AM

Can you watch ASCII movies on that?

fpmatters said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Anonymous said...

And what about MS giving a shit about IE6 CSS etc. flaws for several years? IE is something you pay for...

Anonymous said...

IE is something you pay for...

Not that I know of, it's pretty free last time I ran it in wine.

Anonymous said...

Also IE6 is something from the XP era, you know, now we have IE8. But as always it seems that YouDontNeedTheLastVersion™.

id said...

I was so looking forward to this post ever since I've read the announcement.

Anonymous said...

And what about MS giving a shit about IE6 CSS etc. flaws for several years? IE is something you pay for...

IE is freeware since 1995/6 - that's 13 years.

Shall we compare IE6 with browsers from the same age - 2001 ? Mozilla 1.0 anyone ? The best CSS support I know of started with Opera 7 - a few years later. You should give Opera a try if you're not a fan of IE, it's where firefox devs "borrow" most of their ideas from. IE6 is a browser from an age where websites were still carved out of tables and iframes.

Anonymous said...

Fuck those DIV and SPAN tags. Fuck them right to hell. And CSS? That shit was a joke. They should have just skipped to CSS5.

Anonymous said...

IE6 is still a problem though. Many users use XP today and automatic updates patched IE6 to it's latest version but didn't install IE7 or IE8 automatically. So a simple user still uses IE6.

IE6 has 17% share today, which is huge compared to Opera's or Chrome's or IE8's share. Web developers have to target IE6.

Microsoft can be blamed for slowing down the progress of the internets.

But other than this:
Linux = Epic Fail
Windows = Epic Win

All hail the monopoly!

Anonymous said...

IE6 is still a problem though. Many users use XP today and automatic updates patched IE6 to it's latest version but didn't install IE7 or IE8 automatically. So a simple user still uses IE6.

True. IE8 is now a critical update in XP.

DamnRight said...

Also IE6 is something from the XP era, you know, now we have IE8. But as always it seems that YouDontNeedTheLastVersion™.

More like WereStillIn1996TheLastVersionDoesntCount™. MS will never atone for its sin: delivering a desktop experience that ran within the constraints of the commodity hardware of the day.

Now for the Drepper bug thing: who's right, the asshole mantainer with the Robocop-like one liners or the very persistent RFC nazi? Is it the player, or the game?

Anonymous said...

Wow. It was just a matter of time before it would come to this (no suprise).

Zeke said...

Windows is full of ignorant users no wonder their system gets nothing but viruses, spyware, trojans and what not. aha fucking ignorant fanbois

Anonymous said...

Did anyone hear about the latest upgrade from Ubuntu Horny Hardon to Jacking Jerkoff? Apparently Intel graphics sucks donkey balls. That's right, Intel the people that write nice open source graphic drivers.

Watch this 45 minute video on why linux sucks. It's worth it.

It takes 5 minutes just for him to get his laptop working with the projector, and then Open office presentation is just messed.

Anonymous said...

To summarize some of the finer points of the video:

-Drivers are messed. Lady talks about upgrading the kernel, then having to spend 45 minutes reconfiguring the computer so that dual monitors work.

-Audio is messed. Way too many abstraction layers. Mentioned a lot here.

-Way too many packages. Skilled coders are thus spending too much time repackaging the same thing for 45 distros instead of new exciting things

-Duplication of work.

Anonymous said...

OLPC the poster child for Linux.

The latest version of Sugar, the operating system doesn't even work right on OLPC hardwareAnd all those crappily coded games for previous versions won't work in the new version. Because nothing is funner than rewriting software for the same platform rather than expand it, or create something new. still get a kick out of this: relationship can be explained thusly: Microsoft has some XO machines. They are trying to get Windows working on it. Sometimes they show up and ask random hardware questions. The OLPC guys say “look at the code.” They go away again. Sometimes they brick machines (because they have to replace the awesome firmware we have with a poopy PC BIOS) and send them back to the office to get them unbricked. Sometimes they complain that the machine has hardware problems and we reply that it works fine here. Meanwhile their awesome firmware bricks the machine and field complaints about hardware problems are aplenty.

And of course their awesome firmware makes it a pain in the ass to even boot other linux distros.

Anonymous said...

Lady talks about upgrading the kernel, then having to spend 45 minutes reconfiguring the computer so that dual monitors work..

I gave a presentation today on my Vista notebook. Got the projector working and the screen cloned in a matter of few seconds. Of course, this is nothing ground-breaking and it's just what one has come to expect from a modern OS... but looking back at my past as an ex-Linux user, I could only think: "thank god I don't use Linux anymore".

What I can't understand now is how I managed to put up with that kind of crap that makes you waste half an hour just to get your presentation started. What is it about Linux that brings out this delusion, this vivid, irrational "I want to believe" mantra?

Anonymous said...

But I thought the whole point of Linux was being an arrogant dick? Has something changed? Will this affect the shittiness of regular end users?

Is it trickle-down douchenomics? Does the shitty attitude start at the top and spread down to the idiot Ubuntu users, or is it something inherent in the philosophy of Linux?

Anonymous said...

You broke my heart, LH!

I was expecting something more like "" from you...

You seem to hate that guy as much as the other freetards...hmmm...

Frog said...

I think this quote form Linus says it all: "Whether it's intentional or not, that doesn't matter, people
perceive you as an arrogant know it all who is extremely
difficult to work with. And you can be sure that projects
that you are the primary maintainer of, such as GLIBC, suffer
because of it.

moonbeam_rider said...

Well,the above video is pretty cool and actually completely without flame :)
On the other hand,new Intel DRI driver is messed because of dispute between Intel and Tungsten over a gem and ttm implementetions ;)
They compromise to use some mix of both and that solution is currently pretty sloppy-thats the main reason why fresh Intel drivers sucks ;)

Anonymous said...

All because building closed source drivers for Linux it's nearly impossible. Look ad nVidia that managed to have partially closed source drivers to make things work, and AMD/ATI that had to open source the drivers after pressure from the community. The fact is, even with the full driver code there are no developers that can make them work, and work well. Everyone wanted them to be open in the first place, but it seems useless if hardware mainteiners have to do all the job for the community, and that means keep up with the constant changes in the kernel.

Maybe if linux users would throw more money to hardware manufacturers then something could really change. Until then it's just a waste of money to support a useless desktop os.

Anonymous said...

See guys, the biggest problem ALWAYS was not that Drepper was an asshole.

It does not matter if he is an asshole or not.

The problem is that if you have people who act arrogant and bossy in upstream important packages, you poison the whole climate and environment.

I am still sceptical that this move is any good, but if it does away with Drepper, it will be good enough.

Anonymous said...

I'd love to see the scene in reality:
ATI: Here it is your drivers.

Freetards: Fuck you! They suck!

ATI: Your kernel API/ABI changes all the time, we can't keep it put with it. Here is the source code. Good luck!

Fretards: Fuck you! You won't support us! OMG EVIL M$ CON$PIRACY!

ATI: Ok Pay us open source drivers. After all is freedom as in freedom, rrrrrrrriiiiiiiight?

Freetard: Boycott ATI! Don't buy from them.

ATI: Fuck you. No more drivers for you.


Anonymous Insider said...

LH seems very acquainted to the most dark freetard affairs...

I wonder if he has connections with Mac OS X with some ramifications towards FreeBSD.

Nonetheless, thanks for helping promote the fragmentation in the Linsux world!

Anonymous said...

Anonymous said...

Anonymous said...

Now this is just amazing:

A problem is identified, analyzed, and a valid solution is proposed. Feedback is depressing.

Finally, the maintainer "admits" he made some "final changes" and closes the bug. Obviously the patch proposed by the reporter was out of the question, so the motherfucker cooks up a two-liner, and did not even test his brain fart. The original bug is still there. Just grab the latest tar-ball and suck it.

I dont fucking care if the function in question is a joke or not. If it is documented, then it'd better work as expected.

Way to go, foss.

Horatio_Hellpop said...

Wow ... just, .... wow:

Two of the bigger names in the Freetard-o'-sphere, going after each other like fourth graders.

No wonder desktop Linux is a mess. What a bunch of candy-ass pussies, arguing like InternetToughGuys(tm)

Anonymous said...

It takes 5 minutes just for him to get his laptop working with the projector, and then Open office presentation is just messed.

He never really did get it "working"; he had to put the presentation in the upper-left box and then rotate-unrotate the cube every slide for a headache inducing effect.

Anonymous said...

@Zeke: yep. Just viruses and trojans. And a few actually working useful apps that Linsux is still missing.

Anonymous said...


you probably heard of Jörg Schilling and the desaster with cdrtools

Haha, I haven't thought about dear old Jörg in forever. Old time users will remember all the fuckin' strange multi-layer SCSI emulation voodoo required to get CD burning to work.

cdrecord was built around SCSI, so the run-of-the-mill ATAPI drives had to run in SCSI emulation mode. Fair enough since Windows did the same thing (but hid it way better). But regular old Linux SCSI mode wasn't good enough; that would be too easy. Once you got your drive in SCSI mode (which actually was kinda difficult back in 1997), you had to use Jörg's custom made bizarro SCSI abstraction layer. He claimed he modeled it after the perfect Sun method, but you needed the abstraction on Solaris, too. Truth is this was just another "I think everyone should do things in the vague way I have it in my head" and the result was the typical buggy abstraction mess we've come to know and love with sound layers.

And! Even when you had it working it could break the next time you attached something like a ZIP drive or USB stick. That's because Linux didn't have a reliable way of assigning "SCSI generic" devices so you had to edit config files and stuff whenever Linux mistook your sneeze for some SCSI commands.

Best part was the Drepper-like attitude. Developer after developer inquired as to how to better integrate cdrtools/cdrecord with Linux and the responses were like, "Linux sucks. Use Solaris. You don't pay me. Fuck you." And cdrecord would wildly break between minor versions just like Linux kernels do now.

cutugno said...

Well, Drepper is a jackass, yes, but this move by Debian folks pissed that they lost a dicksize war to him is just... well, beautiful.

Looks like something had to be done, sooner or later, but this looks like the worst solution possible.

Oh well, opensource.

Anonymous said...

Guys, cool down a bit, unfortunately it seems that you're missing something important what has been going and why people behave way they do.

"That's right, the problem is that Ulrich Drepper is too giving and helpful a person and we have to protect him from himself. Shocking but true."

Statement from Roland, the guy who started the whole glibc thingy almost 20 years ago (some of you were probably not even born yet) and who has been involved with glibc than he cares to admit:

Anonymous said...

The most classic outburst is the glibc-2.2.4 release announcement, a full frontal against RMS himself!

Anonymous said...

Shave my nutsack and call me Betsy. With the attempt to get Drepper out of the equation (not the first fork, mind you) it actually looks like the clowns got a late Easter present. And this little story has been spreading from basement to basement like moles on speed, so there's actually a good chance that the fork will be supported mainstream.

But this is not what concerns me. What keeps puzzling me is how a publicly traded co. like Red Hat allowed this kind of public farce in the first place. First off, he's not an idiot - let's get that out of the way. But he does seem to be irreplaceble if you take everything into consideration.

Which leads me to the question: why didn't Red Hat replace him:
(a) there are no people on the market to fill his place since this level of SW engineering is a small world
(b) there are people but they don't want to work for RH
(c) throwing out Drepper means he'll be picked off by competition like we saw with quite a few other devs in the past
(d) Red Hat couldn't be arsed about this non-event

Could someone shed some light on this pleace ? Thanks

Anonymous said...

@May 7, 2009 1:04 PM

What a blast from the past. Makes me feel old.

Anonymous said...

Drepper is too busy arguing with people to take a few seconds to copy and paste some code.

Anonymous said...

Slashdot article from 2003 claiming Linux will have 20% desktop share by 2008Didn't happen. Indeed, I will bet anyone that Linux will never have more than 10% desktop share (it will probably never have more than 5% share).

Anonymous said...

I kind of like him. He's annoying and condescending to other freetards, who are generally annoying and condescending to the rest of the world. What's the problem?

Anonymous said...

That's right, the problem is that Ulrich Drepper is too giving and helpful a person and we have to protect him from himself. Shocking but true.

Just a variant on, "Leave him alone he does it for free you don't pay him it's just a hobby," which is all bullshit. The next person in thread complains about the familiar problems of arbitrary and undocumented changes to glibc.

Anonymous said...

"nothing but viruses, spyware, trojans"

That's still a lot fucking better than being stuck with that Linux disease on your PC!

So yeah, because some retards go out of their way to run as admin, on their totally unpatched box, without an AV, and then run any old .exe from kazaa means they should switch to a shitty outdated, worthless OS with shitty hardware support and no good apps? Yeah, that sounds so much better!

Lintards are such dumb fucking cunts, it never ceases to amaze me.

Anonymous said...

I will bet anyone that Linux will never have more than 10% desktop share (it will probably never have more than 5% share).

I'm pretty sure you're safe betting they'll never have more than 1% plus statistical noise. If that's too aggressive for you, than surely 2% is far enough out.

For kicks, I found this IBM site with a graph of desktop operating share. They put MacOS at 6% and Linux at 4%. Basically, this means that for every three Macbook slinging yuppies you see strolling about you should also see two lusers. Obviously this isn't true, so here are some theories.

* They can't take their laptops about since Linux's 1993 vision of power management (they still call it "APM") kills their laptop batteries in 35 minutes with hilariously outdated functionality like 6:00 AM cron jobs.

* They have to leave their laptops home because by taking them off AC they risk it going to sleep and thus never rebooting, which takes about five minutes in Linux land.

* These people never leave their basements. However, statistically, over 96% of computer using people do indeed leave their houses regularly, contrary to popular belief.

Anonymous said...

Aww come on, some of them go out to browbeat people into not buying a vista based machine from their local shop, fail miserably, and then come in here to say how they've saved the TEH WORLD FROM WINDOZE ($$)(After the cops release them after another caution)

Anonymous said...

Aww come on, some of them go out to browbeat people into not buying a vista based machine from their local shop, fail miserably, and then come in here to say how they've saved the TEH WORLD FROM WINDOZE

My favorite are the stories about how an entire family was moved to Linux with "zero support complaints". If these people get all emotional and soap boxy with their family like they do on message boards (and you know they do), their family probably just goes along with the Linux thing to shut them up and never calls them again, at least not about tech stuff. As soon as the kid's out of the house, grandma calls Geek Squad so she can get her Java bridge game back.

Anonymous said...

More Typical Slashdot Pants-Shitting as Windows 7 approaches

Lusers looking hard for something to criticize.

JuanDV said...

Since everybody has been throwing links around, look at this guys:

So Linux is good enough like to run 87.80% of the top 500 supercomputers in the world... I guess that's a good example of how much Linux sucks!

Anonymous said...

>So Linux is good enough like to run 87.80% of the top 500 supercomputers in the world... I guess that's a good example of how much Linux sucks!

LOL you fool, I can't believe you actually used the "Supercomputer Argument". It's been said so many times on this blog that freetards always fall back on that as an argument. Hilarious to see a freetard actually come here and use it. I guess next you will mention that runs on Linux?

Anonymous said...

@May 7, 2009 9:24 PM

I dunno about you, but I'm all about protein folding and ballistic vectors on my home PC. Of course they could be building super computers just to boot slow ass Ubuntu Stupid Sloth.

Oh, and did you know LAMP is *the* choice of domain parkers? I know you didn't. Isn't that like totally awesome and useful? Switch to Linux today so that you too can park domains and fold proteins!

Anonymous said...

Wow. Linux will come in handy when I build my own HPC cluster for home use then! And of course, being able to crunch numbers means it's a great desktop OS, for sure. Right.

(I'd sooner run Windows HPC)

JuanDV said...

@May 7, 2009 9:24 PM

I use the supercomputer argument just as much as you use the driver argument. It's the wildcard didn't you know?

@May 7, 2009 9:32 PM

Well, what a surprise you're no scientist...

It is also funny to see how you all think that Ubuntu=Linux... in my opinion Ubuntu sucks, because it is just a petty rehearsal to bring Linux to the masses... and as I said yesterday, Linux (the real one) is for the elite... so it is natural for you to not understand us, don't worry... now I'll go back to my protein folding?

Anonymous said...

Switch to Linux today so that you too can park domains and fold proteins!Except you can do protein folding an order of magnitude faster with a Windows PC with an Nvidia card, thanks to CUDA.

Does this magical 1% market share include all the *BSDs? I mean, a professional tech publication called FreeBSD the "next version of their Linux OS"... (See the last LH article's comments.)

Anonymous said...

Except you can do protein folding an order of magnitude faster with a Windows PC with an Nvidia card, thanks to CUDA.

That's why we need a whole cluster rather than just one PC, duh!

Does this magical 1% market share include all the *BSDs?

Almost certainly. OS share reports have pretty much consolidated to Windows, MacOS, Linux, iPhone. I think the rest of the "not Microsoft" systems have gotten so obscure that Linux gets padded as a catch-all.

Alvarez said...

aplay < /usr/bin/python
grep "suicidegirls" ~/pr0nPass/*

And why the FUCK would I want to fold proteins with the GPU ?? What is the CPU for ??
Next time I'll skip the CPU part and buy a PC with only GPUs, maybe it's faster...

Anonymous said...

aplay < /usr/bin/python
grep "suicidegirls" ~/pr0nPass/*

Only a freetard would qualify that cumbersome process as "automatic".

And why the FUCK would I want to fold proteins with the GPU ?? What is the CPU for ??
Next time I'll skip the CPU part and buy a PC with only GPUs, maybe it's faster...

Translation: YouDon'tReallyNeedThat(TM)

thepld said...

"And why the FUCK would I want to fold proteins with the GPU ?? What is the CPU for ??"

Yeah! And for that matter, why would you want to render video on the GPU? Or sound? only idiots buy graphics cards and sound cards!

For claiming to be more knowledgeable than Windows users, its truly hilarious for a freetard to not know about using the GPU as a general computing device. Wonder when the lusers will get OpenCL support?

Anonymous said...

First of al we're talking about Linux on the desktop here. Your wonderful supercomputer can stay where they are, we don't care about them.

Ubuntu as of today is the major Linux distribution on desktop. We know it sucks, but that's what new Linux users get.

All I see is a bunch of guys praising their own OS like it's a god's gift, telling everyone to stop using OMG M$ CON$PIRACY WINDOZE and use Linux instead because it's awesome, has better applications, there's the community, and you can compile your own kernel. And then, when people talk about HUGE flaws in Linux on the desktop all you say is "Linux is for the elite" or "Linux is awesome on supercomputers".

Whatever you say guys, Linux on the desktop STILL SUCKS. There are so many fucking problems, drivers is just on of the many. There are even a lot of Linux users who tell this, I don't know if you've seen this video, if not you should.
We're not here just to bash Linux like most of the freetards do with Windows (it has it's flaws too), we're here to tell freetards to pull their heads out of their asses and start fizing problems. Their little fantasy world cannot work in the reality, people want the work done, and done fast, on their desktop machines they use at home or at work, not waste time in CLI just to make sound work or reconfigure anything after any upgrade.

Anonymous said...


Oh yeah, OpenCL, the fosstard's clone of CUDA. But you DontReallyNeedCUDA™ right? xD

Also we could use a YouDontNeedTheGPU™.

Anonymous said...

Day by Day I slowly lost faith in Linux ever since the 90's for some kind of consolidation, at least the desktop environment. Fast forward 19yrs later and we're worse off than before. Now we even have 2 glib files. yay. Progress? (sarcasm)

The next hobby OS won't be based on Linux (too much baggage both by licensing, design, political and emotional).

Bye Bye L9inux, You're now the Millenium Amiga.

Anonymous said...

The real reason why Linux rules on supercomputer.

From this article:

Seager says the lab chose Linux partly because it is "open source," meaning users can change the code to suit their needs. Also, they can use Linux without paying a licensing fee.

Basically because you don't have to pay for it. Btw a modern supercomputer is only a cluster of normal P.C. and the only thing that matter is the performance/cost ratio.


Anonymous said...

If that's the case I think most of them would migrate to OpenSolaris when it's time. It is also free and open-source, but it's way more stable than Linux.

Anonymous said...

"If that's the case I think most of them would migrate to OpenSolaris when it's time. It is also free and open-source, but it's way more stable than Linux."

Or a FreeBSD variant. But I think that in the lab there is a sort of "Linux bias", similar to the Unix bias in CS.
Really, there is no technical reason why Linux should be there, apart maybe for some supercomputer application developed for it.

captcha: ingent, the time spent on Linux to get things to work

Anonymous said...

Linux isn't for the elite. It's for dumb fucking cunts whose time is worth nothing.

Linux is like if I could give you a hybrid between a Lada Niva, a Ford Pinto and a Hyundai (the worst of all 3) and say it'll only take 6 months of work before the engine even starts, and there are no standard parts for it or anything. And it comes with a religion too, and don't forget to RTFM before you go ask on IRC about anything and so on.

Meanwhile, us Windows guys are just buying Hondas instead and get on with our lives. They ain't free, but it actually works.

Anonymous said...

I am reminded of the last notable fork (that I can recall)... When Xorg forked from xfree...

It changed nothing, xorg sucks as much as it always did.

So now begins a two or three year long thing where everything is broken because it needs this or that version of glibc. Oh wait, my bad, thats how it is now...

Anonymous said...

Why use the GPU? Because it fucking rocks when it comes to crunching numbers. Your CPU is like a cripple old man and your GPU is like an Olympic runner in the context of number crunching.

Anonymous said...

AFAIK, Cuda is available for several platforms, including Windows and Linux. Whats the issue here?

Anonymous said...

So Linux is good enough like to run 87.80% of the top 500 supercomputers in the world... I guess that's a good example of how much Linux sucks!..


Dunno, maybe you don't really need to connect a supercomputer to a projector :D

Anonymous said...

You need a supercomputer for decent speeds in Firefox on Linux.

Captcha: undearif

Anonymous said...

Captcha: grapp -- it actually is something. grapp

Anonymous said...

"AFAIK, Cuda is available for several platforms, including Windows and Linux. Whats the issue here?"

The fact that its implemented in a closed source driver, and the freetards responded to this in two ways: By A) You don't need that (TM), as evidenced in an above comment, and B) creation of an incompatible standard years after the actual pioneering work was done by ATi(Brook, I think) and nVidia.

Anonymous said...

Yep, using OpenCL would mean forcing hardware producer to implement this standard. The only Open* standard widely implemented is OpenGL, and not because it's "open", but because when SGI dominated the high-end graphics market this was the only standard for 3D rendering. Now OpenGL is abandoned from more and more game studios (even ID migrated to DirectX). OpenGL 3 was a total failure, so much hype for nothing.
Anyway it's supported because it's still used by many applications, mainly in professional fields (CAD for example).

If freetards manage to puch OpenCL so hard into the market and have it supported then good for everyone, but right now they have marketing skills of a retarded lemur.

Richard said...

This reminds me of the fork of Xorg from Xfree86, too. The person above suggests X now sucks as much as it did then, but it doesn't. A lot of desirable change has finally been allowed to flow. Sadly, testing relatively sucks and there's now massive instability, but who cares if it freezes your machine once a day on certain Intel chipsets: pretty features and Teh Future!

Anonymous said...

Simple point open source development moves forward with competition.

egcc forking off of gcc caused expand in features and stability in gcc. forking of xfree86 created competition so lead to improved development. Not as fast as what lot of people here would like but it did.

glibc is one of these kind of items no competition so no pressure on quality.

eglibc is just another in this line.

Ulrich Drepper and GregKH have gone head to head in the past over defects in gcc and glibc. So basically where were you Linux Hater you missed it.

In compare GregKH is nice. Just does not believe in closed source drivers. Just because he has a different point of view to you Linux Hater it no grounds to be insulting and comparing to Ulrich Drepper.

Open Source developers don't always see eye to eye that is to be expected. Insulting over it really does not have to be tolerated.

GregKH will explain out his point of view. You explain out yours and if its a draw he just agree to disagree and let time be the judge.

Ulrich Drepper at times expects people to be mind readers. Then insults when they don't understand why.

Sorry they cannot be compared as being anywhere near the same class.

GregKH was one of the major pushes to have the drivers not up to quality but need to users added to the main kernel tree even went as far as taking the responsibility to see to there improvement.

So GregKH is a person who is working for the good of everyone in his eyes.

So thank you very much Linux Hater for insulting a key person with a track record of being nice and polite.

Forking exists to deal with problems of personalities. Lack of focus on core parts has caused sections to be left in bad state.

So you had to do personal attack instead of following the causes. No project in open source is past being forked away from people not suitable to run them.

Really on insulting level I would love to see Drepper and Linux Hater locked in a room and only the one that lives gets to leave. At least we would be rid of one insulting person off this earth.

There is no reason for personal attacks to point out flaws. It seams Linux Hater has run out of researched data. So is reducing himself to the equal to a tabloid journalist with self motivations.

Anonymous said...

Seems like oiaohm, but lacks RT kernels and mysterious NTFS bugs. Also some senteces are comprehensible!

Anonymous said...

>I would love to see Drepper and Linux Hater locked in a room and only the one that lives gets to leave.

LOL sorry, but that was pretty funny. Oiaohm 2.0?

Anonymous said...

Can I ask a sort of serious question? What exactly do Desktop Linux (Ubuntu) developers run on that they think their releases are actually good? Are they all running on the same specific hardware? Do none of them have DVD players or WiFi cards (or for that matter, laptops)?

Anonymous said...

Real Linux users start from Busybox and bootstrap their own GCC, kernel, and libc.

Anonymous said...

Yes Linux is used in some high performance computer clusters, and servers, and some embedded applications. Huge difference from desktop computing.

In the first two cases you have skilled workers who have the knowledge to set it up, and keep it going. That makes it "worthwhile". In the case of embedded, a skilled worker designs it, and then it's NEVER TOUCHED AGAIN, so there's nothing that can break. I don't remember the last time I went "sudo apt-get" on my router or television.

Desktop computing is a whole different ball game. Most users don't have the time, skill, patience, or knowledge to recompile their kernel so their wireless driver works. They just want to watch DVDs, visit Myspace, and sync their iPod. They treat their machine as an appliance, not as a high performance computer cluster.


Anonymous said...

Linux is used in some high performance computer clusters, and servers, and some embedded applications. Huge difference from desktop computing.

Where have you been? The iPhone has the same requirements as IBMs z series.


Anonymous said...

We should make "TheBook™", you know, all those (TM)s.

Anonymous said...

On the other hand,new Intel DRI driver is messed because of dispute between Intel and Tungsten over a gem and ttm implementetions ;)
They compromise to use some mix of both and that solution is currently pretty sloppy-thats the main reason why fresh Intel drivers sucks ;)

Anonymous Insider said...

Hackers breach UC Berkeley computer database

First there was the LOL hack. Now it's UC Berkeley. What OS do the freetards run at UCB?
"The server breach occurred on Oct. 6, 2008, and lasted until April 9."

Bill Gates said...


Bill Gates here, richest man alive. This man has the attitude we need at Microsoft. I will gladly pay him a seven figure salary to do customer service at my fine corporation.

Bill Gates

Anonymous said...

Hey it's the most securiest, non-malware-gettiest, un-hackerizable OS in the entire universe! Alls you have to do is install it on your server and post "WINDOZE $UCK$" a few times on and voila, you're completely secure!

captcha: filesten

After every 23 reboots, please run sudo filesten to check the integrity of your unstable ext4 partition

Anonymous said...

Does this describe the typical poster here?


"Linux sucks" is your new attitude towards life. Windows, all things
considered, ain't so bad. You resolve to become a better Microsoft
customer by participating in the Microsoft Developer Network and the Site
Builder Network. You buy a bunch of "study guides" to pass the MCSE

You launch a Windows advocacy site on some dinky free webpage provider,
utilizing the latest innovations in VBScript, ActiveX, and other
IE-specific features. Instead of lurking, you now actively participate
in Linux and Macintosh bashing on various Usenet groups. Upon discovering
Slashdot for the first time, you assume the role of the Bastard Anonymous
Coward From Hell by posting countless flamebait posts about how cool
Microsoft is and how much "Linsux" (as you call it) is a crappy OS.

You proudly wear an "All Hail Chairman Bill" T-shirt and display numerous
pro-Microsoft bumper stickers ("Honk if you hate anti-trust laws") on your
car. You never leave home without your Windows CE-based palmtop computer.
You make a pilgrimage to Redmond to marvel at the glory that is the
Microsoft Campus.

Anonymous said...


Anonymous said...


LOL the trolls are excellent today.

cap: smsms - freetard fork of SMS; your text messages aren't free enough

Anonymous said...

BREAKING NEWS: Rob Malda reviews new Star Trek film

Anonymous said...

@May 8, 2009 12:15 PM

Where have you been? Apple gets more love here than at Slashdot.

Anonymous said...

@Anonymous, May 8, 2009 12:15 PM

I don't fucking get why all the linux zealots who post here claim that this blog is about loving windows.

There's not a single post about that. The whole blog is about why we hate linux. But as always, when one says one bad thing about linux, he's a Microsoft blind lover.

Fuck no. Most people in this blog are people who believed what zealots say about linux (it's faster, it's simpler, it's more user-friendly, it can do more things, it's more secure, it's the heaven), switched, realized that all the propaganda is just a big lie, and the zealots are spreading it like adepts spread guru's propaganda (yes, I'm comparing zealots to adepts).

You know, that makes me think of something: linux is like the movie everyone told you is fantastic, so you go to the theater with great expectations, and then you get disappointed. I can guarantee you that if you just told the truth, and did not spread fucking propaganda, this blog wouldn't even exist.

Oh, and by the way, fuck the zealots who say "linux is so easy, my grandma uses it and has no problem". One today told me "I installed a computer for my grandma, I put ubuntu and she's doing just fine. I just had to install it, fix some little problems, and now she can browse the internet without any problem. I just SSH to her computer to run the updates, and to help her when something doesn't work".
Yeah, so that totally proves that ubuntu is grandma-proof. I mean, she just needs a nerd to fix her computer 4 times a week, that's totally acceptable. I have a new idea for the next ubuntu brainstorm : make Shipit! ship a nerd zealot with every DVD they send, so that anyone can use linux.

Zealots : would you please just stay in your fucking linux world, and let normal people live with whatever OS they use, without spreading propaganda ? Thanks.

Anon E Moose said...

Gotta love the binary world that these 'tards come from. If you don't Love Linux then you must therefore Love Microsoft

Rebels without a clue, the lot of you idiot freetards.

If you weren't idiot rebels without a clue, then you would not be freetards.

I'd hardly call what goes on here as Windows Advocacy (damn I must have revealed myself as being Pro-MS because I didn't type Windoze or M$ or Micro$UXXORZ~LOL). For one thing, neither Microsoft nor Apple *need* community activism to promote/sell their wares.

That's for Linux users, who need to convince people that repeatedly flogging your own back really feels good.

'tards amuse me, and that is why I come here. I am secure enough in my software choices that I not only do not have to defend them, but that the thought of anyone needing to do so seems utterly ridiculous.

So dance, you paranoid martyrs of the FOSS movement.


You are truly LH's puppets.

Anonymous said...

>I have a new idea for the next ubuntu brainstorm : make Shipit! ship a nerd zealot with every DVD they send, so that anyone can use linux.


Anonymous said...

ship a nerd zealot with every DVD they send, so that anyone can use linux.

Are the costs of abnormal amounts of pizza and Coca Cola factored into the TCO? Can you claim the nerd zealot as a dependent on taxes?

Anonymous Insider said...

Outstanding posts, keep them coming!

Honestly, I'm surprised how stupid freetards really are...

Don't lusers remember the great BSD Linux wars from the 90s.

Can't freetards figure out the Apple nerd v Windows business dude commercials aren't directed towards MS Windows users.

Those commercials are directed towards the non MS Windows market share, the market share that's normally labeled Other Operating Systems.

Apple it's trying to get those Windows haters users that might be fooled by Linsux.

Lusers, don't you remember Red Hat's efforts to bring down OS X's market share down. If not here are these videos from 2004:

Part 1a 
Part 1b 
Part 2a 
Part 2b 
Slides [PDF]

Being a retard isn't cool!

Anonymous said...

Those commercials are directed towards the non MS Windows market share, the market share that's normally labeled Other Operating Systems.

This is the smartest thing anyone's said in a while. I tried the argument of Apple absorbing the remaining "not Microsoft" market but never tied it together with Apple's advertising campaign. Well done.

Anonymous said...

I use an old G3 500mhz iMac running Panther as a living-room based file server. The GUI is faster than Ubuntu 9.04's GNOME on newer hardware. Applications load slowly of course but once they're loaded it's fluid. Very sad. Mac OSX is about ten billion times better than anything any Linux distro has to offer, and it's considered a real UNIX as of Leopard. Take that, freetards!

Anonymous said...

I use an old G3 500mhz iMac running Panther as a living-room based file server.

We still have two 1st gen slot loading 350MHz Blueberries running Tiger with 512 MB RAM in service for interns and as a quick backup. It's still quite usable and really only runs into trouble with Flash, whose PPC implementation is the pits. Otherwise it makes for a fine document writer.

I have a 500 MHz Celeron with either 512MB RAM which I used for testing Ubuntu and and confirm that the experience was horrendous compared to MacOS on similar hardware.

Anonymous said...

Oh yeah, besides programs taking somewhat longer to launch, XP works fine on that 500 MHz Celeron.

Anonymous Insider said...

As I said before, LH is too well acquianted with what's going on in the freetard camp.

Hence, he-she most likely isn't a Windows user.

The logical conclusion is LH is an OS X user with deep connections within the BSD camp as I've noticed the sepulchral silence when I bring back things like Solaris 8 source code, the BSD SMP meeting at Yahoo, etc [ links ]

Anonymous said...

Brings back memories of me falling for the "Linux is teh fasterrr" LIE and installing the PPC version of Ubuntu Dapper Drake on a G3, thinking it'd be snappier than OSX (I was thinking, it would perform the way OS9 did but I'd at least be able to load Firefox et cetera). Boy was I ever wrong. It was slower than OSX. How is any rendition of GNOME slower than OSX when it has no graphics effects? This was even before compiz-whatever was the norm so it truly makes no sense looking back on that experience. Bizarro world bullshit.

.net jerkface said...

Hey insider,

There are a lot of people that work with linux during the day and switch to windows/osx when they get home. Not all linux programmers are slashdotters who worship a clone of a 1970's mainframe OS and an ideology involving a collectivist software license written by a Berkeley hippie who doesn't have to work.

There are a hell of a lot of lamp servers out there so for many people linux is just a job.

If you pay close attention you'll notice that a lot of the vocal linux bloggers are in fact liberal arts majors.

Anonymous Insider said...

Cool, so I hope Linsux keeps its server market share so OS X hackers may have a daytime job.

So why is all the hype against Linsux on the client?

Just let the lusers be happy with their 1 point market share. This way they'll keep the server market functional. The idiots work for free, don't they?

If you OS X hackers play the game properly, you'll be able to have the best of both worlds.

What's the problem with having to deal with delusional loudmouths on the Web?

Just ignore the lusers.

Isn't the Amiga curse behind Linsux and not Mac OS X?

Anonymous said...

Do you want to know why Linux is dead on the desktop?

Because freetards think for-pay software is evil. look at the comments of this review of SoftMaker. Typical freetard whines like "Why would I even consider paying €70 for a proprietary office suite that is inferior to the free and open source alternatives?"

Did I mention that SoftMaker office is a free download but only for Windows users. If you're using Linux, you still have to pay for it.

Windows kicks Linux's ass because of software like this (and Ventrilo which I use to talk to my buddy since he can't use Skype). Sure, I could get AbiWord or OpenOffice for Windows, but why bother when a program like SoftMaker exists, is free, and doesn't have the bloat of OpenOffice or the instability of AbiWord.

.net jerkface said...

Insider sez:
Just ignore the lusers.

Ha yea fucking right. The linux plague infests the entire IT world.

In the corporate world you have the foss advocate asswipe who tries to push linux in EVERY possible situation regardless of technical or economic merit. Such asswhipes become frustrated and angry if a business goes with an MS solution, even if the business is pleased with the results!

Then you have the internet where tech news sites are dominated by linux advocates, not just editors but commenters who want to silence any criticism of the people's OS. ZDnet/slashdot/osnews should all just align and become the people's democratic IT news services for linux revolution.

The constant shilling for linux has really gotten old. It was fucking old in 2003.

Yet we still have to endure crap like this:

Note that tech republic is a zdnet sister site.

Useful software will be adopted naturally, especially if it is free. Useful software doesn't require widespread propaganda, smear campaigns, or endless excuses to encourage adoption.

Linux has made impressive gains on the server because it was cost-effective to commercial unix. On the desktop it is pretty much useless unless you are looking for a revolution to join and have no chance at all of ever getting laid.

Anonymous said...

Here's my favorite recent Tech Republic article:

10 reasons why Linux will triumph over Windows

Apparently in this guy's world, Microsoft has been losing ground since Windows 95. I guess he hasn't noticed how freaking exponentially larger the personal computing market has gotten since then, largely to the credit of Microsoft.

Anonymous said...

"20-second boot time, btrfs file system, Better C++ support, Cups PolicyKit integration, DNS Security (DNS SECurity), ext4 default file system, Fingerprint reader integration, IBUS input method replaces SCIM (to overcome limitations), GNOME 2.26, KDE 4.2, Windows cross-compiler inclusion."

Oh yeah, when the average consumer or business make feature demands this is the list.

I walk into Best Buy and ask from GNOME 2.26 with better C++ support and the EXT4 filesystem.

And finger print readers? Oh, you just now get around to having a feature that every other OS has had for years and all of a sudden it's a reason to jump ship?

I guess if I made an OS tomorrow I could just say "Oh yeah, well I support keyboard input! Take that Linux! You fucking suck! I also boot in one second! I have no applications. The experience sucks balls but the OS is up and running in one second; therefore everyone will jump ship to my platform."

Then of course he mentions Windows is hardware incompatible and Linux is the epitome of hardware compatibility? Really? Then why the fuck are there so many fucking posts on every forum going "SOMEBODY FUCKING HELP ME MY HARDWARE DOESN'T FUCKING WORK!" or something to that extent?

Anonymous said...

Notice the further time goes along and the more it becomes obvious that Linux is a total failure on the desktop, that we see more and more of these articles. Freetards are quaking in their shoes at the impending release of Windows 7.

Anonymous said...

Don't you know? Consumers have been begging for unstable filesystems and overly complicated PostScript printing wrappers for years.

Anonymous said...

In a way it really is sad that people's identities and sense of worth have become deeply tied to an operating system. But, in another way, it's absolutely hilarious!

Anonymous Insider said...

160,000 at risk after U.C. Berkeley database is hacked
It's on TV!
Holy fuck, this is hilarious!
Please tell, which freetard OS is used at UCB?

Anonymous Insider said...

OS, Web Server and Hosting History for
According to a FAQ, in "early April, computer administrators within UC Berkeley's University Health Service (UHS) discovered that hackers had breached a computer server containing electronic databases used to store personally identifiable information belonging to a large number of UHS clients."
Then it seems hackers got into UC Berkeley's University Health Service (UHS) via Microsoft-IIS/6.0 running on Windows Server 2003.
Did you see UC Berkeley's University Health Service (UHS) was running via Microsoft-IIS/4.0on NT4 on 27-Apr-2008?
What is this shit, a self inflicted sabotage?

Anonymous said...

Microsoft IIS 4 at Berkeley? Isn't that like doing shots at a MADD meeting?

Anonymous said...

You know guys, I recently tried MenuetOS. Compared to Ubuntu this is fucking nice. It was a bit slow, I had to run qemu in 64bit mode (emulated on my 32bit Celeron M 430) to run the latest version (it's 64bit only, 32bit version is outdated).

IT FUCKING WORKS! Everything really works, apart from the huge slowdown from emulated mode it was still faster than Ubuntu on the same machine, but 32bit version. It also has a lot of applications to start doing things, and even has some 3D effects like Win7/Vista. The whole OS can be put on a floppy disk, and runs completely from memory (with some addon you can install it on a hard drive).

If it gets more and more contribution (even if it's not open source), this could really crush Linux on the desktop without effort. It just fucking works for god's sake, and it's supported by one single developer.

Anonymous said...

MeneutOS is pretty good for what it aims to be.

All written in ASM. Mad props to the programmers.

Anonymous said...


Sucks is not a scalar type. It is boolean. Something either sucks or it doesn't. xfree sucked the in the sorts of ways it sucked. Xorg sucks in the way it sucks. When you use it, have to do anything with it at all, before and after, you come away with a feeling of... Wow this sucks!

This will change very little, do you know why? In linux dev groups there is an unlimited quantity of assholes. They have only gotten rid of one single asshole, in a culture of assholes.

Anonymous said...


Yeah. Also it's nice to see that making a simple window with event management on this OS it's so clear, even if you don'r really know assembler at all (or in this case FASM). The same example on GTK+ even if written in C it's so fucking confusing, what the hell. Even in Qt on KDE it's a mess to read. And that's what you have to do to use X11 directly. Yeah, even the Win32 API is a mess at this level, I don't know about MFC (I'm not a C++ programmer) but this seems to be way different from the API it abstracts from. On the other hand .Net and Mono are really simple to use, but really, for something written in assembler as an amateurish project this is really nice.

Makes me want to buy a 64bit machine dedicated to MenuetOS.

(captcha: morte, in italian means death, something Linux on desktop is facing right now)

Anonymous said...

For the LULZ:

"I believe that the all the ZDNet figures were spot on. If anything, the Linux desktop market share has continued to increase and is probably currently at 8-10% and rising. Dell and the other PC OEMs wouldn't have invested in selling Linux pre-installed if it appealed only to less than 1% of the desktop market."

Anonymous said...

W32 asm isn't that hard compared to the menuetOS and there are a number of decent tutorials online. I fucked around with it after a friend gave me an eye-candy demo app some 12 years ago (can't remember the name, but it was full of these plasma effects - real plasma, not color cycling) which demonstrated that it's perfectly suited for asm programming. But after a while it becomes apparent that asm programmers aren't the main target group ... it's about IDE magic.

I had a quick peak at MenuetOS, it's really impressive what these guys pulled off and I hope they continu along the same path. Asm is a pretty time-consuming approach, but as a side-effect these folks think 8 times before changing the API/ABI. Thanks for the link.

Anonymous said...

Richard Stallman eats.. something.. from his foot:

Oh My F***** God.

Anonymous said...

This video is very insightful. Do you really want to run software on productive systems from this guy?

Anonymous said...

@May 9, 2009 5:39 AM

You can develop for MenuetOS in more languages I suppose, there are some more goodies like a C library, a GUI toolkit, some utilities and library ports like libmpeg.

Anonymous said...

For the LULZ:

Wait, a lintard is complaining tech journalism is biased against Linux? Did I read that right?

I get to see a lot of computers in my line of work, both personal and business. A figure like 10% means I'd be coming across Linux machines on a regular basis, but it's never happened. I've never witnessed anyone using it outside of my geek friends. I see Apples all the time, but even the most aggressive estimate puts those at 10%.

Anonymous said...

By the way, anyone notice if you go to directly using IE8 it shows a link imploring you to upgrade to Chrome? Do the same thing in Firefox and it doesn't. I predict in the future the link will show up for Firefox as well, once they get serious about Chrome.

Anonymous said...

A figure like 10% means I'd be coming across Linux machines on a regular basis, but it's never happened.

Indeed. Anyone saying Linux has more than 5% is full of crap.

From the freetard blogNoScript makes it so they can't count us.

Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. I'll give you a clue: Linux browsers put, in their header, a message saying "this web surfer uses Linux".

Despite this, non-geek websites don't show more than 3% of their visitors using Linux. W3counter shows 2.16% Linux usage, 1/2 of Mac usage; W3Schools shows 4% Linux usage (this is a Geek website), again less than mac usage. Why is that?

What evidence do you have of a large percentage of Linux users cloaking their browser to look like IE6 or what not? I mean, I could act like a freetard and make the unsupported claim all that Linux growth is Windows users cloaking their browsers to look like Linux browsers.

Why is not in the Alexa top 500, but in the Alexa top 10?

To be fair,'s numbers do look promising to Linux. But, I don't think they'll go over 15%. Since W3Schools is a geek site, I am demanding a 15% Linux market share on this computer, not 10%, before I declare we are in the year of the Linux desktop.

Anonymous said...

I've been a loyal Slackware user since 1994. Patrick Volkerding "gets it". You don't see him running around like a little bitch screaming for people to use his distro.

He doesn't have to, it speaks for itself.

All my home servers and a few at work run Slackware. That being said, I fucking love Windows 7.

I didn't have to download a single driver when I installed it. Not one. Click, click, done.

Ubuntu: click, click, done, no wait, what's that thing in the upper right hand corner that says there are 300 updates available, click, 45 minutes, click, reboot (yes, it does happen in linux for retards), my resolution is different and my sound doesn't work, why are my windows shaking, oh it installed compiz, what a waste of resources just so my windows can wobble.

Its not very coherent but neither are Fosstards.

Also, to the guy the mentioned CUPS before.


CUPS is the perfect example of Linux retardedness. You think the sound developers would have learned from the mess that is CUPS. Nope, we'll just have to configure 18 different fucking libraries.

Anonymous said...

One more thing zealots. Find me one Fortune 500 company that EXCLUSIVELY uses Linux on the desktop. I want facts, not "My dad says they use it at his company."

Good luck.

Anonymous said...

i truly believe those "desktop linux market share" percentages must be taken with a grain of salt

the 1% "barrier" has been reportedly broken just recently, after 15+ years of being consistently and steadily below that threshold

OTOH, linux is maily attractive because of its null cost, and of the hype that surrounds it
it's entirely possible that people
will continue to be lured into trying the allegedly superior product
but, since by definition people trying linux anew are NEW potential users, some starting to use pc's some coming from other OS's, they'll likely try linux with somewhat high expectations, that at least it is a modern OS, that at least it fulfills their needs and is actually useful
they may even be willing to endure the major PITAs of linux non trivial day to day use, (thus paying the system with their time if not with their money - time IS money, you know) in exchange for the ability to be productive

but, after the trial period, they'll invariably discover that apart from the very "being different", some browsers and open office, (oh, and some professional 3d app, but only certified for some old distro) linux doesnt offer much on the desktop / workstation side

then, unless they like running linux for the sake of it, they will switch away leaving their place to the next conceited youngster in his mom's basement, and this will repeat as long as linux doesnt get high profile usable applications and a consistent desktop

linux users have come and gone, linux itself has come and gone innerable times on people's drives in the last 15 years
for this reason we'll hardly see linux' share will hardly rise above current levels and never reach the 10% mirage (in fact nothing guarantees it will continue to rise, it may equally start to shrink and get below 1% again in the near future)

because people will continue to come and go, different people every time

captcha: "bition" , i.e. a crippled ambition (lol)

Anonymous said...

10 reasons why Linux isn't triumphing over Windows

Say it isn't so.

captcha: bionalit, N: A new text editor that will allow bionic Linux users to input code via direct access to the OS.

Anonymous said...

11. Linux Just Fucking Sucks And You All Know It

Anonymous said...

I seem to get into statistical based arguments on a fairly regular basis; the tactics Linux folk use are typical. Most people (even "math" people) don't really understand statistics and are even skeptical of the science's validity. However, unconsciously at least, they understand enough to know that they don't have a chance in dissuading a general audience from accepting statistical theory, so they shift the battleground. The most common example is the the unsupported claim of, "this group of people are different so the statistics, which factor averages, don't apply here." It's a cute way of disregarding the obvious inferences of solid mathematics while simultaneously appearing to appeal to the mathematics.

Ignoring that NoScript does not, in fact, suppress User Agent strings (because they're part of the HTTP protocol, not JavaScript), the "Linux can't be counted cuz of NoScript" still fails because not everybody who uses Linux:

* uses Firefox
* is aware of NoScript
* finds NoScript useful or trustworthy
* wishes to (further) slow down and destabilize their browser with unsanctioned functionality
* is able to install the functionality due to permissions, policy, or lack of knowledge

While the claim that Linux sees more user agent hiding on average can be accepted without controversy, the claim that user agent hiding is exclusive to the point where Linux essentially vanishes from statistical measurements cannot stand without solid evidence. Also, if NoScript really did hide user agents, these would show up as its own category in charts. While this wouldn't tell the proportion of Windows/Mac/Linux within the category, it'd speak to the overall volume of usage. Since charts have effectively done away with the "unknown" category, we can infer that receiving unexpected browser output is below the margin of error, or, statistically insignificant.

Finally, I haven't read the counting methodologies of the major sites, but there's valid reasoning behind "Linux" hits not counting as much as "Windows" or "MacOS" hits due to the abundance of part timers and looky-loos in the Linux realm, which are less common to the other two platforms. I would make the same argument were Windows 7 to start making headway in usage graphs; Windows 7 users are unlikely to be using it as their main OS regardless of what usage graphs say.

Anonymous said...

because people will continue to come and go, different people every time.

Actually, no.

This equation stands as long as it has novelty value. A year or 2-3 ago you would've been forgiven for not knowing Ubuntu and its siblings as a tech-minded person. These days the novelty and polish have worn off. The number of people willing to try it has decreased, but there's also an increasing amount of people who actually tried it and know it's shite.

Yesterday evening, had people over from my street. We do a small event every year and it's a way to get acquainted with the new kids. One is in construction, one in research and 4 in every day jobs.

None of them had heard about Win 7 - I had just installed it so gave a demo.

All but one of them had heard of linux.

One asked if I could install linux for him - because he would screw up. I told him he was right and that he should install 7 himself: saves us both time since it's only a few clicks. 24 hours later and just heard that my DVD is in the 3rd house for installation. Nice.

Anonymous said...

OK, I just saw a new FreeTard retort: It's really easy to update software in Linux, just type in "sudo apt-get update" and everything's updated.

If only it were so easy.

Speaking as an open-source developer, I can assure you that "sudo apt-get update" often times leaves a freetard with a buggy, outdated version of the program.

I would rather update things the Windows way, where each program is responsible for managing its own updates, but ensures you have the latest stable version of the program, instead of doing things the Linux way, where updating a program often times doesn't give you the latest update.

Anonymous said...

Going go to play with my Mac, and maybe even use the terminal. Because I can.

Anonymous said...

Slashtard of the Day

Anonymous said...

So sick of zealots like that. What planet are they from that Microsoft is comparable to murderers? People like that are Linux's TRUE problem.

Anonymous said...

I noticed Microsoft just laid off another 3000 employees. So we are at -8000 MS employees now? Of course this has nothing to do with Linux or does it? Hmm, Apple doesn't seem to be laying off people. What is Microsoft doing wrong?

Anonymous said...

When you can convicted for violating a criminal law typically you are a criminal. Microsoft got tried and convicted for violating criminal law. Microsoft is an organization. Well then it follows that Microsoft is a criminal organization.

Anonymous said...

@May 9, 2009 3:24 PM

With the information given in your post, a more natural conclusion would be that the layoffs were due more to Apple than Linux.

Anonymous said...

@May 9, 2009 3:27 PM

One (critical) flaw in your argument: Microsoft was never convicted of a felony. Go ahead, look it up. We'll wait.

Anonymous said...

Whoa, you dudes are fast. That comment was rated +2 when I posted it and, whoosh, it's -1.

Anonymous said...

I noticed Microsoft just laid off another 3000 employees. So we are at -8000 MS employees now? Of course this has nothing to do with Linux or does it? Hmm, Apple doesn't seem to be laying off people. What is Microsoft doing wrong?

If there's one thing Desktop Linux script kiddies have proved it's their lack of insight in the market. You fucking posers actually think your little hobby OS has an influence on MS or Apple ?!? Don't know if you noticed, but apart from a few hundred versions of minesweeper there aren't any applications on that pile of duct-tape.

Have a look at the stock, and tick the box for Nasdaq, ORCL and IBM to see what's happening.

Fucking Foss4Brain.

Anonymous said...

If Microsoft is having problems, it's probably because the entire global economy is having problems. Naturally, delusional freetards wouldn't understand Microsoft being affected by the financial situations of the corporate customers that they provide their extremely useful software to. Delusional freetards think it's only about home users buying copies of "Window$ Vi$ta" of off Newegg. That said, many multinational corporations would kill to have Microsoft's current "problems": $25 billion in cash and on the verge of releasing a widely lauded new product into a market where the only real competition is from their own previously released products.

Anonymous said...

Micro$haft is having problems because nobody wants their crap. Now that they can't pay as many people to hold guns to your heads people are doing what they've always wanted to do and switch to Linux. That's why Linux market share is up so high lately.

Anonymous said...

Desktop linux is a joke

Anonymous said...

I noticed Microsoft just laid off another 3000 employees. So we are at -8000 MS employees now? Of course this has nothing to do with Linux or does it? Hmm, Apple doesn't seem to be laying off people. What is Microsoft doing wrong?No, the recent layoffs are included in the previously announced 5000, brining the total to somthing like a bit over 4000. Mostly they're just clearing out the cruft to stay lean, since Microsoft is still hiring plenty of new talent.

Anonymous said...

Again with the "they literally aim guns at you" argument. I'm surprised no one's come up with a (TM) for this yet: MicrosoftPutsAGuntoYourHead(TM)

DamnRight said...

You know, two weeks ago MS was a bloated, overstaffed dinosaur has-been. Now they lay off people and all of a sudden it's obvious it must be a Linux-induced crisis. Can't you guys at least agree on this bullshit? Some kind of Propaganda Standard Base initiative?

Anonymous said...

Some kind of Propaganda Standard Base initiative?

They can't even agree whether it should be /lib/fud or /lib/FUD.

Anonymous said...

The only standard thing about Linux distros is that they all suck.

Anonymous said...

@May 9, 2009 10:44 PM

No. They still suck in so many different ways, it's unbelievable.

(captcha: bustort, seems like a fork of dbus)

Anonymous said...

What the fuck guys it was just a question. I'm not using Linux or FOSS you assholes. I didn't imply that Linux did anything to Microsoft if you fucking reread what I wrote.

Anonymous said...

There is a Linux zealot mathematics professor in my university who hopes to mathematically prove that Linux will overtake Windows.

Anonymous said...

Awesome, too bad there are some many variables he couldn't possibly determine the out-come. He'd be more likely to make a formula to predict lottery results.

Anonymous said...

or, also given consideration i made in post above, you may even guess linux' share as a function of time, is a bell shaped gaussian like curve, with the apex in T=now

that would have the same likeliness of being true as any other guess on this matter...

Anonymous said...

I think Ubuntu is the worst PR for linux on the DT that is imaginable. Untested release after release, poor hardware support, user base as a herd of beta testers ...

Why can't they see that the amount of newcomers is a pool which is not unlimited. Something elese these guys don't seem to get is that the best advertisement is word of mouth - which is backfiring on them.

They're adopting the firefox ditribution model for something which is completely different. An OS isn't something which you install two or three times in a year to try out.

Over the past few days I've tried win 7 and it's fucking awesome. Not even the slightest hickup and I'm on an OEM-locked laptop. It's actually so good that I wonder how they'll convince people to change again after it - as in the current state where users don't want to leave XP.

There have been a few remarks by others here that hail the lack to explicitely install drivers on 7. What I found remarkable is that all my media plays without installing codecs.

Anonymous said...

"The only standard thing about Linux distros is that they all suck."


Desktop linux is kinda like VHS (about 2 generations behind technology wise). Sure you can use it, sure it'll do the job, but your movie selection and enjoyment experience are very limited. There are much better options (BSD/OSX/Vista/XP/Windows 7) around.

Today's geek is not so much concerned with the OS itself, but what you can do with the OS using third party freeware or commercial software. People nowadays no longer have the luxury of time, we all have to work and go home, and get things done asap.

WaitingForSomethingToHappen(TM) is not cutting it anymore. Sometimes the best desktop experience is where the OS is almost trans-parent in the background. Letting you do what you need to do, without getting in your way or making to hard or inconvenient. I don't want to edit a text file or compile source just so I can play DVD movies. I don't want to worry about Intel video driver issues which are standard on so many notebooks. I just want things to work and work well whether I watch movies, suspend, or output to a projector.

Anonymous said...

@May 9, 2009 11:22 AM: According to the last Fortune magazine, 90%+ of Fortune 500 companies use Symantec products. Symantec products are the purest form of garbage one can use.

My favorite part about linux is when freetards say "And you don't have to dish out $20 every time you want to use a program"

Seriously? Not everything is pay-commercial software. In fact the true irony is that a lot of FOSS software is a lot more popular, and better for Windows / OS X than it is for Linux. See: Bloat Office (open office), Firefox, Audicity, Virtual Box, 7-zip. A lot of other Open source & freeware options overshadow what's available for Linux as far as functionality, usability, or stability. Compare GIMP to, PhotoFiltre, etc.

In fact on my Windows machine I rarely buy any software. However for work related niche markets I still have the ability to run commercial software that simply cannot run on Linux. And it's these programs that makes business happen and the world go 'round.

WeThinkAllSoftwareForWindowIsCommercialPayware(TM)Re: Chrome: They already bug firefox users on Youtube, and other Google sites. I find it odd because Chrome is a lot buggier than Firefox. And I'm using SRWare Iron (for privacy reasons) and Spell check is broken. What a piece of shit.

Anonymous said...

There's nothing like IrfanView on any platform besides Windows. Still looking for an equivalent on OSX to this day. (Speed and easy batch processing). If I weren't lazy right now I could pull out more examples of free kickass Windows software.

Anonymous said...

There have been a few remarks by others here that hail the lack to explicitely install drivers on 7. What I found remarkable is that all my media plays without installing codecs.

I needed to download a driver for the 4-in-1 card reader on my laptop, but, all things considering, that wasn't bad at all considering Microsoft's installer is "OEM clean".

I, too was impressed h264 worked out of the box, but you still need, at least, Haali Media Splitter to make MKV and OGM work. Not a big deal for the average Joe, and I actually wouldn't expect Microsoft to spend time on technology that doesn't even have ratified standards. But I'm sure the brigade will point this out as a sign of inferiority. Had Microsoft included the support, they'd be accused of embrace and extend evil terrorist monopoly tactics.

Anonymous said...

Sometimes the best desktop experience is where the OS is almost trans-parent in the background.This was pretty much my initial impression of Windows 7. Besides the potentially useful tricks and such I discovered, my thinking process was, "Well, it doesn't do much besides let me install software," but that's pretty much the point of an operating system these days. One of the things I like about 7 on my laptop, compared to XP, is that I no longer need eight OEM installed system tray icons that hook into standard frameworks like power management and change them in unexpected ways. I'm sure this will come back once OEMs start shipping their versions of 7, but it's nice to know the underlying OS now has the necessary functionality.

Anonymous said...

What the fuck (from the official release notes):

A bug in the kitten-sitter package in some cases leads to kittens being swallowed whole by systems running Karmic Alpha 1, nom nom. Investigation of this issue is ongoing; in the meantime it is highly recommended that you do not leave small felines unattended in the presence of Karmic Alpha 1.

Has Linux really gotten so buggy it's bugs kills little animals in real life? This is worse then I thought.

Anonymous said...

The Ubuntards had like a 20 page thread going on UF about the Karmic Koala theme, which Shuttle said was going to be designed by professionals. Clearly a GNOME theme is their biggest concern. Anyone got any leaked screenshots or something to laugh at?

Anonymous said...

Whatever it will be, it will certainly be an improvement from the shit brown theme Ubuntu has now.

MaraDNS said...

One thing really nice about Windows is that there are a lot of office suites out there, free or otherwise.

I recently posted a blog listing free Office suites and word processors, and have another blog about TextMaker, which is my current favorite word processing program.

As it turns out, when you get a Dell computer, you always get Microsoft Works for free if you elect not to get Microsoft Office; sometimes, the freebie Microsoft Works is the version with Microsoft Word as the word processor.

Speaking of Dell, here is one statistic showing under 1% Linux Desktop usage.

Linux isn't a bad operating system for what it does (web hosting or file server); its problem is its idiotic fanatic users and developers that treat Linux like a religion.

Anonymous said...

I agree MaraDNS, I enjoy messing around with Desktop Linux from time to time. But I would never lead anyone on telling them it's a replacement for OSX or Windows. That is where the big problem is coming in. It really is just a hobby OS or if you want to learn some commands because you want to know more about Linux servers. I'm really turned off by the whole "death to Microsoft" thing.

Anonymous said...

Linux isn't a bad operating system for what it does (web hosting or file server); its problem is its idiotic fanatic users and developers that treat Linux like a religion.Indeed. Unfortunately there is a lot of "religious" guys out there, that treat any Linux criticism as a blasphemy and their immediate reaction is to deny it. No matter whether it's true or not.

I recently do enjoy flaming on freetart forums. Even though I try to be as moderate and as technical as possible.
Response to "Linux UI is slow and I can see buttons painting one at the time" (which is true -- I noticed it even on Fedora's shutdown dialog window): "No it is not, you damn Windows lover! Try CDE or some other Motif- or plain-X11-based UI! It works fast, so it's not Linux' problem! It's some other community's fault! Oh, and at least we do not have viruses!"

Captcha: surove -- means "raw" in Polish (written "surowe"). Just like Linux UI is.

Anonymous said...

In what capacity is Linux a good file server??? Horse shit. WebDAV. If you are serving files over the internet, you are using WebDAV and linux WebDAV is horrible and incomplete.

Linux is good at supercomputer nodes (it is cheap, it is easily surpassed in every other way by HPC windows and Mac, including core effiency) and LAMP(once again it is cheap), and that is it.

Unless you are doing one of those two things, Linux is an awful choice. Anyone who claims otherwise is a fosstard.

Anonymous said...

I got nothing to say but the captcha is "layho". That is what Lintards wish they could do, lay a ho, but they are too busy tweaking .conf files.

Anonymous said...

Neeh, I'm pretty sure hoes are not open enough. Or at least not GPL compliant.

Anonymous said...

and, hoes usually cost money, thus they are by definition not free...

Anonymous said...

A blogger that posts relationship advice posts a humorous little anecdote about people using Macs in a coffeeshop he frequents, and a fosstard brigade shows up to promote Linux. Read the comments from "welmer", "whiskey" and "RW". Motherfuckers are everywhere. What do they have, some kind of Batman Bat Signal style alert to let them know when someone, somewhere posts something sorta-kinda OS related on the internet?

Anonymous said...

Lenovo Thinkpad. That’s a real man’s laptop.In this case: "that's a real never-got-laid-man laptop".

Anonymous said...

What do they have, some kind of Batman Bat Signal style alert to let them know when someone, somewhere posts something sorta-kinda OS related on the internet?it looks so
there's this wonderous "comic strip blog" (in italian, unfortunately - for those who want to have a look anyway ) i regularly visit to get the smile of the day -
even on there, i see linux tards flock en masse whenever the strip is about the author's life with his PC (his allegorical depiction of Windows and the CPU is gold, by the way :D)... no place on the interwebs is safe from the herd

Anonymous said...

@May 10, 2009 2:00 PM

Un altro italiano?

Anyway, freetards are everywhere on the net. I can work without meeting a single one of them, then when i get home, tired, and connect to see what's going on in some community i regularly check there they are, bashing Windows and praising Linux.

Just the other day someone said Ubuntu was so fucking awesome, even better than Windows, faster, more reliable, without viruses. Mhm, the real problem was, he couldn't get wifi to work, even after checking on UF for help. What the hell can you do in Ubuntu without internet connection?

Anyway, this guy proven to be a real moron. First of all he thinks he's a "professional programmer", the same day he asked for help on making XML files with Java. When I told him to append the text on the file instead of rewriting it he replyed with something along the lines "I'm trying to add the text, not rewrite it completely, what do you mean by append?". The same guy also told that you can use ASP in Flash.

Ubuntu is like a bait for idiots.

Anonymous said...

no place on the interwebs is safe from the herdBut every place is safe from hurd because they still don't have a usable kernel.

Anonymous said...

Altro italiano qui. Magari qui siamo tutti italiani e non lo sappiamo, ehehe...

"I'm trying to add the text, not rewrite it completely, what do you mean by append?"

Io non sono un programmatore, ma questo me lo hanno insegnato al corso di C ad ingegneria. C'è gente che guadagna soldi programmando e che non sa queste cose?

There are people who make a living as programmers who don't know wath append to file mean. Wow, just wow.

Anonymous said...

WebDAV is horrible and incomplete.

How is WebDAV in Linux horrible and incomplete?

Anonymous said...

It raped his ass (horrible) but he failed to climax (incomplete).

Anonymous said...

Linux isn't in Netbooks' future says Lenovo:

Anyone actually surprised?

Anonymous said...

God ... the comments are getting worse by the day. Some extracts:

- Linux doesn’t require anymore IT skill than Windows
- Once it’s installed it needs far less work than a WIndows OS
- Linux is an efficient, lean operating system that works well on low spec hardware, which makes it ideal for netbooks
- If people “stay with Windows” it is mainly because of these associated factors: 1) FUD about Linux (or other OSes indeed) fueled by Microsoft and Co.

I think this one marks a tipping point.

Anonymous said...

I can't believe they're still using the "Windows wins because it's preinstalled" argument with regards to netbooks. And are blaming the mass shift to Windows as "Microsoft sponsored FUD". Have they missed that the consumers themselves tried and rejected the product? Other than offering a working solution (for more money) Microsoft has nothing to do with it.

Anonymous said...

"Other than offering a working solution (for more money) Microsoft has nothing to do with it."

This is something a true Linux believer will never accept as true. In the bizarro world of the Linux Loon, all the PC vendors are in compelte control of Microsoft. Constant antitrust supervision by the U.S. and European authorities never manages to catch Microsoft's manipulations. For whatever reason, MS cannot stop any of the vendors from selling any Linux servers despite the complete control it enjoys. MS is also unable to stop vendors from offering Linux on desktops or netbooks to start with.

With all this unmet demand for Linux netbooks and desktops, and with all the major vendors under Microsoft's thumb, you would think a bunch of Linux bums can join together and make a killing selling Linux machines. For some reason, that never occurs. The Loons are just content to wait for Microsoft to self-destruct, which is bound to occur when MS releases the next version of Windows, whichever that may be. The only reason Microsoft is able to avoid self-destruction so far is, the vast majority of users are lazy idiots and prefer the familiar OS to the superior one.

Did I cover everything?

gsp said...

Continue to fight, and we will continue to have your back.

Anonymous said...

sony reader uses montavista linux and the interface is slow and buggy

linux = fail

Horatio_Hellpop said...

Ok, just installed PCLinuxOS 2009 on a whim on my home pc -- already had Vista on it, had some extra space.

Install seemed to go ok. But the video drivers were whacked. I took a deep breath, went to init 3, and (as i did six years ago) installed the .bin file after downloading it from the Nvidia site for my 9600 GT card.

ok, seemed to work, added the kernel mod. Init 5 ... good, I have a X session, nice.

Poked around a bit ... Gnome is looking better ... decided to do an apt-get update .. then did apt-get upgrade.

Big mistake.

Totally borked the Nvidia drivers I had installed ... overwrote them with some freetard version in the PCLinuxOS repos. Lost all compiz effects, and screen resolution is terrible.

What's more, wireless stopped working.

Rebooted with Vista DVD ... fixmbr ... wait until 2010.

Linux is pitiful on the desktop.

Anonymous said...

@May 10, 2009 5:48 PM


I win, now STFU.

Anonymous said...

@May 10, 2009 3:58 PM

L'append alla fine esiste in qualunque linguaggio abbia un minimo di operazioni file di base. Il fatto stesso di definirsi programmatore esperto, pretendere un pagamento di 500-1000 euro per un sito in Java (non ho idea se intenda usare una applet Java infilata in una pagina statica o un sito in JSP), e tutto questo senza nemmeno sapere cos'è l'append. Peggio ancora quella cosa sull'XML gli serviva per creare un semplice RSS. Praticamene abbiamo perso giorni per spiegargli come funzionava, nonostante le tonnellate di guide su Google che gli abbiamo passato.

Peggio ancora è che considera la sintassi di ASP stupenda rispetto a PHP, e quella di Java ancora meglio. Ma mi sa che non ha ancora compreso che Java e PHP hanno una sintassi C-like molto simile...

The world is really full of jackasses, pretending to be paid 500-1000€ for a fucking website, and not even knowing what is an append, how to write files, or the difference beetwen languages.

Sometimes I have the feeling that people consider themselves like gods of computers just for being able to understand what a if-else does, and pretend to be as important as someone with REAL experience just for that. Fortunately clients wants also quality in products, and that's where those self proclamed gods fails miserably.

Anonymous said...

I don't understand why linux XML support is apparently so primitive that people are using either rewrite or append raw file writing modes on it...

I mean, in C# you just put a ISerializable directive in the class and you are pretty much done... You can overload the serialization functions but... Why would you?

.net jerkface said...

The Windows 7 beta has been out less than a year and currently has about half the market share of linux:

Not a single one of those installs came from an OEM.

Enough with the fucking excuses already. Linux sucks shit.

I wouldn't even bother using it for a lamp stack. Use WS2008 web edition or freebsd if you want a free unix.

Speaking of lamp stacks I found this funny:,339028299,339286434,00.htm

Note the disclosure in bold before the actual article. He has to tell everyone how super stable and awesome linux is before describing how to force linux to auto-reboot after a kernel crash.

Anonymous said...

@May 10, 2009 11:36 PM

What the hell. So if Linux panics it's always fault of something else: hardware fault or some bad software, but even if it's open source and EveryoneCanMakeItBetter™ you don't fix the problems, you blame them on who made this software.

True fosstard's thinking here.


And I thought Linux would never reboot!

Anonymous said...

More idiocy

thepld said...

"More idiocy"

Note that the freetard headlight is the first to adopt a combative tone. I especially like how he accuses 7 of being nothing but a conspiracy to sell more hardware (despite having much lower requirements than Vista and being on par with XP in terms of performance)

thepld said...

And fun fact: When I last tried it, KDE 4 had a compositing system. I tried it out on my shitty Intel graphics laptop. When I enabled it(and it didn't need root credentials), the system froze and I had to reboot. When I rebooted, the system froze again. I had to boot to console and edit a KDE config file to undo the option.

KDE 4: Where an option enabled by a non-root user can totally hose a system.


Anonymous said...

I especially like how oblivious he is to the Windows customization community. There are many applications that can do what Conky does. Windows has been able to move the taskbar to any side of the screen since Windows 95.

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